The second-place candidate in the primary wants to have another debate. Perhaps there was something he forgot to say in the previous debate. Not many people showed up for the previous debate.
There is no better way to reach the citizens than using The Citizen so I will offer some of the debate points from the previous one here. You will find there are some significant differences between me, Clint Holland for Post 3, and Mr. Crane who came in second.
By the way, The Citizen did a fantastic job of asking us questions and allowed for thorough answers that they are still on the website at https://thecitizen.com/2022/10/16/something-to-like-about-something-to-wonder-about-with-all-5-peachtree-city-post-3-council-candidates/.
Voters will easily see by reading the answers on The Citizen website that there are some significant differences between my opponent and myself. I will offer a few of those differences here to appease my concerned opponent. He can reply if necessary.
Anywhere I go in Peachtree City the 54/74 intersection is a major complaint. Mr. Crane said, “I’m not positive there is a true resolution for 54/74.” I do not have to say he is ambivalent on the issue, as he said it himself.
The main point for me is the City Council has done almost nothing to come up with a 54/74 intersection solution. Mr. Crane has been on the city’s Special Purpose Local Option Sales Tax appropriation committee for years and they never try to tackle the intersection.
The two intersecting highways belong to the state government, and they need to pay the lion’s share of the solution. I think the moderate overpass option has merit and we need to work with our state legislators on walking a proposal up to the Georgia Department of Transportation. The residents are begging that we do something to fix the problem.
The state government knows there is a problem and have tried to get away with proposing a small modification that will not solve anything. It is time to start pushing forward.
The voters can choose from a distinct difference of philosophy on taxes between candidates in the runoff. We are all burdened with higher prices and steep inflation with the Federal Reserve saying interest rates will climb even higher.
I opposed the unnecessary tax increase, and the city government was able to roll the millage rate back this year but refused to do it. My opponent said, “I agree with the decision to not roll back the millage rate this year.” He said maybe next year.
The voters also have a distinct difference in philosophy on building more multi-family apartments in any format. I am going to throw the yellow flag and call Mr. Crane for a “political double-speak” penalty. At one point he said, “I will vote against building multi-story apartments in the city,” but then he later proposes, “I would like to see some business lofts as a form of mixed-use in the city.”
My opponent cannot have it both ways. He wants to build apartments over retail stores and divert heavily from our traditional planning. He tries to convince us that the dentist who rents the retail space wants to live above the practice, or that the insurance agent with a wife and three kids will live in the apartment above the retail office. We all know that is not going to happen. Calling apartments “lofts” does not make them any less of a multi-family apartment complex.
My position is very clear. I will vote “no” on any type of multi-family units as we have more than enough now. I am opposed to the recent efforts to urbanize Peachtree City.
The Citizen asked the candidates if we would vote in favor of removing the recent changes to the city’s Comprehensive Plan that allow the construction of multi-story apartment complexes all over the city. The best response Mr. Crane could come up with was, “There were a lot of changes to the City’s Comprehensive Plan. Some I agree with and others I do not.” He offered a vague reply that was the furthest thing from a decisive position the voters would want.
My position is very clear on this one too. I will vote to reverse the changes in the Comprehensive Plan that allow the construction of more multi-story residential complexes. I was appointed to serve on the Comprehensive Plan Committee, and I firmly objected to the methodology used by the city to arrive at the far-fetched conclusion that more multi-story apartment complexes are needed or desired.
There is a significant difference between candidates, no doubt.
I hope I can count on your vote during early voting, November 28 – December 2, or Election Day on December 6. I appreciate you and I appreciate the special community we have in Peachtree City.
Clint Holland
Candidate for City Council Post 3
Peachtree City, Ga.
On this issue of to debate or not to debate, at the Meet the Candidates Political Forum, Clint Holland said that he wished it was more of a debate than a forum. Dr. Crane has offered the opportunity to have that debate. Clint Holland had the opportunity to respond with a simple yes or no. Debates are typically a part of almost every election. I do not understand why proposing a debate is bullying the candidate who brought it up in the first place.
Anyone looking for candidate positions on issues should read their articles published in The Citizen. This electronic paper reaches far more people than any “debate” could reach.
For Clint Holland, go to:
https://thecitizen.com/2022/10/16/post-3-candidate-clint-holland-answers-the-citizens-questions/
For Phil Crane, go to:
https://thecitizen.com/2022/10/16/post-3-candidate-phil-crane-answers-the-citizens-questions/
They each have websites:
clint4ptc.com and VoteForCrane.com
I doubt that any “debate” would enlighten anyone more than the detailed questionnaire answered in The Citizen, and by reading their respective websites.
If in doubt, read Steve Brown’s summary: https://thecitizen.com/2022/10/24/examining-peachtree-city-candidates-positions/
There is adequate information to make an informed decision.
This is really weak and suspect to say the least. We’ve had a lot of trouble with elevating PTC newcomers to elected office in the past several years. I don’t want to paint with a broad brush, but Holland’s brash nature and quick vote of confidence from the likes of Steve Brown deeply concerns me. Crane seems much more humble and is from Peachtree City giving him a better understanding of the city and it’s issues as well as more loyalty to PTC’s values. I hope we don’t repeat our mistakes with Mr. Holland.
Time in residence here is less important than a commitment to preserve Peachtree City’s unique beauty and features.
Time in residence is actually important here. And Clint’s shown his backside a few times with a complete lack of historical context that will cost you and I money.
The moratorium is a perfect example. He was preaching bringing it back – it was removed because it unconstitutionally violates the right to due process for property owners. The city would be forced to fight a losing lawsuit, and then have to pay the legal fees all around.
We literally just went through this complete lack of understanding with Gretchen and y’all are trying to make the exact same mistake. Twice. It’ll just be more wasted tax dollars getting burned up in court.
Kenneth . . . Really ?
Your diatribe sounds like the schoolyard bully who is upset because the kid he wanted to throw rocks at during recess, won’t come outside to take the beating you so clearly want to give him.
I do have a question for you . . . if your ideas were so wonderful, how come you’re not in the “run-off”?
Your other plan that you, Rick Bryant, Phil Crane and Pamela Kemp will get Clint Holland on live stream/video so all of you can gang up on him, is reason enough for Clint to steer clear of your vitriol.
It appears your rage is blinding you. The only terms Crane set forth were to live stream and record. If Holland is foolish enough to pick Pam, Rick and Kenneth to moderate the debate, then that’s on him.
If Holland was smart, he would have agreed to the debate and chose his mentor and coach, Steve Brown, as the moderator. I’m sure it would have been the epitome of fair and neutral.
Iwalkthebridge — When you can’t attack the message, attack the messenger.
Iwalkthebridge, if “ganging up” on Clint is asking him the how and why of his plans, count me in.
On Clint’s campaign page, he states he is a definite YES to close Crabapple Lane. He lives on Loring Lane between Crabapple and the Parkway. This vote will benefit Clint directly. I’ve asked him repeatedly why he wouldn’t recuse himself from this vote and he won’t respond.
We just went through this with another newcomer to town, Gretchen Caola and it’s now costing us $100,000 to fill her abandoned seat. History is repeating itself.
Hard pass.
Don’t know the number of Citizen readers or hits on this article, but I suspect it’s far greater than the attendance at a debate. Not many citizens attended earlier forums….
We are lucky to have Dr. Holland step up as a fairly new PTC resident with fresh ideas, sound common sense, and no political baggage or business in PTC. I might add he has a remarkable resume, check it out on his website (clint4ptc). A true conservative without a hidden agenda. I’m comfortable with what you hear and see from him is what we’ll get.
Wish we had more like him willing to step up and fight for us instead of kicking back in retirement.
We the residents rejected the LCI. Now is the time to reject anyone supportive of LCI.2 with mixed use villages…. The current PTC powers finessed the approval of the Comprehensive Plan, approved the Partner’s Pizza request for mixed use rezoning before even approving the Comprehensive Plan, and unnecessarily jacked up our taxes.
Do the right thing and vote for Dr. Clint Holland, and work to get your family, friends, and neighbors to do the same to counter the ‘nonpartisan’ left’s attempt to get Crane elected.
Also, understand you will have to vote 2 runoff ballots. One for the Ga senatorial runoff election and the other for PTC council. Given only 5 days of early voting, Election Day lines will be long.
Happy Thanksgiving & God Bless Our PTC
I doubt Election Day lines will be long, they were not long at all this past Election Day…many more precincts open really makes a big difference.
Any political candidate who is unwilling to have a debate or multiple debates, has something to hide. Or knows they wont survive the stage verbal combat that is debating. I have an older mentality of wanting to see people in person. I thought it was only the younger generation that likes to hide behind their key boards while speaking from the soap box safe at home. However this article proves that age is just a number.
You don’t want to debate, but are comfortable taking swings from behind your keyboard.
I guess voters can elect you and find out more later.
The offer still stands. I have nothing to hide.
Mr. Holland says “Get off my lawn”.
First off, thank you Crane supporters and the many Democrats throwing in their opinion against Holland, appreciate it. Shows me who Crane supporters really are. Wake up PTC! Crying over not having or having a debate? Really? That’s what you have?
Debates need to be on neutral ground. Debates do not need to be organized and controlled by one candidate. What political organization would be best to host a debate should be your local Fayette Republican Party. Not the Democrats, not the NAACP, not the Rotary and not the candidates. Whom ever suggested to Holland to write articles through The Citizen where comments are usually from the left, needs to rethink this.
Crane seems to have a lot of Democrat supporters, these comments proves my theory.
Aren’t you the woman who got kicked off the executive board at the Fayette County Republican Party?
And echoing the erstwhile GOPer Lane Watts’ residential issues, Cherie doesn’t even live in Peachtree City yet is commenting? Delightful.
This is a non partisan race..why are you trying to label people?
They both labeled themselves.
CherieBWerginz, what part of any time, any place did you not get? That isn’t Crane making the time and place, it’s Crane offering all of the choices to Holland. I figured I’d better spell it out for you.
And tell us more about the Republican Party. Enquiring minds.
https://thecitizen.com/2022/11/10/peachtree-city-runner-up-issues-crane-challenge/
Got a link? Being serious..I don’t see either one as being particularly liberal.
The City Council seats are non-partisan, so a candidate’s political party is immaterial. That said, the only known Democratic candidate, Kevin Madden, is not in the run-off. Are you suggesting that anyone who considers themself a democrat cannot vote or support either run-off candidate?
What is Clint talking about? There haven’t been any candidate debates, all of the events to this point have been forums of various formats. People have been scrambling in this abbreviated election season to accommodate five candidates’ schedules, venues, moderators, etc for his benefit. How ungracious Clint is toward the organizers of these events. More to the point, how ungrateful Clint is for the voters who attend by discounting their time and interest in their government.
You’re new to town, Clint, so you don’t know that we are a community that appreciates these candidate forums and the opportunity to make informed decisions about our government.
What a horrible, ungrateful, graceless person you are and I’m not even past the first paragraph.
A few thoughts about Mr. Holland:
• Mr. Holland specifically said he wanted the Rotary Forum to have been a debate. Everyone in the room heard it. Dr. Crane has now offered that opportunity, and Mr. Holland is declining. This is a significant backpedal by Mr. Holland. Worse, it’s a missed opportunity to have Peachtree City residents better understand the candidates for Post 3 (especially since Dr. Crane suggested it should be live streamed and recorded for later viewing).
• Since placing third in the November 8th election, Mr. Holland has asked for my endorsement on three separate occasions. In our first conversation I asked him what his plan was for 54/74, and he said he hadn’t publicly share the details because he didn’t want to get “trolled”. I’m glad to see he’s now starting to talk about his overpass, but this letter is leaving out a lot of details. He acknowledged in our conversation that the overpass would cost between $80M-$100M. Most of that money would come from the state, and he wants $20M of that financed by the city through a bond. Mr. Holland may want to roll back our taxes, but then he wants us to go into a debt that’s roughly half the city’s annual budget. How is that conservative?
• Also regarding 54/74, he has never expressed in any forums to address the root cause of our traffic, which is that 50% of vehicles going east/west are traveling between Newnan and Fayetteville. Peachtree City just happens to be in the middle. Only focusing on infrastructure and not the northern bypass to divert that traffic out of Peachtree City would be an expensive missed opportunity (I’d peg it between $80M-$100M).
• Mr. Holland says that Dr. Crane was on the Special Purpose Local Option Sales Tax Advisory Group “for years” and criticizes him and the rest of the volunteers for not fixing 54/74. The SPLOST Advisory Group only existed for several months with the goal of recommending how City Council could allocate $67M to projects within Peachtree City. Solving 54/74 was beyond the scope of the group because that intersection is owned by the state. Mr. Holland’s lack of understanding the SPLOST Advisory Group is concerning, especially since he attended many of our meetings.
• Either Mr. Holland does not know the difference between apartments and condominiums, or he’s conflating the two to support his “urbanization” point. An apartment is defined as a residence that is rented. Condos are owned. Nobody is suggesting having apartments above retail. Condos that are in development within the city (like the ones at Aberdeen Village) are premium products that will sell for at least $700K. Mr. Holland was at last night’s Planning Commission meeting where this was discussed. He should know this.
• Mr. Holland keeps saying he was against the Comprehensive Plan’s methodology. As a member of the SPLOST Advisory Group, I can say that city staff is very accommodating at addressing committee concerns and would make adjustments if a committee feels like it is not getting appropriate public input. If Mr. Holland is upset with the way information was collected, he only has himself and his ineffectiveness to blame.
• If Mr. Holland isn’t effective enough to influence the Comprehensive Plan when he was on the committee, how is he going to be effective at convincing the Georgia Department Of Transportation to abandon the Displaced Left Turn Lanes (which begin construction this spring) for an overpass?
• Mr. Holland’s stance of universally voting “no” on mixed-use is a great way for the city to get sued. It’s in the city’s current Comprehensive Plan, like it or not. If there isn’t appropriate cause to reject a mixed-use plan, a developer can point to the Comprehensive Plan and justifiably win in court. Of course Mr. Holland could try to change the Comprehensive Plan to remove mixed-use, but he was not able to accomplish that when he was a committee member that produced the adopted plan.
Finally, I want to acknowledge where Mr. Holland is correct — there are significant differences between the candidates. One is ready to be a Council Member, and the other is not.
Vote Phil Crane between November 28 – December 2 or on Election Day (December 6).
Kenneth . . . Really ?
Your diatribe sounds like the schoolyard bully who is upset because the kid he wanted to throw rocks at during recess, won’t come outside to take the beating you so clearly want to give him.
I do have a question for you . . . if your ideas were so wonderful, how come you’re not in the “run-off”?
Your other plan that you, Rick Bryant, Phil Crane and Pamela Kemp will get Clint Holland on live stream/video so all of you can gang up on him, is reason enough for Clint to steer clear of your vitriol.
How Clintonian of you to attack the messenger and not the message.
Gretchen Caola ran away when she was “ganged up on” and it’s costing us $100,000 to replace her. We don’t need another weak-kneed newbie that can’t defend their positions. Clint’s slanted bluster above is proof that he doesn’t have the stomach for the job. He has no business stepping into the arena if he considers an offer to debate bullying.
So are you going to debate or is this your response? I think the citizens deserve a debate, not a word salad essay that could be summed up with “I’m just going to try to vote down everything”.
It just seems disingenuous, especially trying to rip on someone for not using SPLOST money to fix 54/74 (absolutely not it’s purpose FYI) and in the next paragraph saying it should be state money to fix it. You can’t have it both ways hombre.
Do the debate.