Fayette officials: ‘We didn’t know about tax breaks’

Fayette County Manager Steve Rapson (L) and County Commission Chairman Steve Brown. Photos/File.
Even after being asked, FCDA failed to notify Fayette about Pinewood deal’s tax abatement
 
“Nobody told us” about the loss of an estimated $144 million in future property tax revenue associated with the Pinewood Atlanta Studios deal, Fayette County officials are saying.
 
In the aftermath, CEO Matt Forshee is leaving the Fayette County Development Authority, while five of the eight members of the authority board are leaving the board.
 
In addition, Peachtree City Councilwoman Kim Learnard is calling the county commission chairman “a one-man wrecking crew” because of the sweeping changes at the FCDA. Fayette County Commission Chairman Steve Brown blamed Learnard’s reaction on her political support of Brown’s opponent, Harold Logsdon, in the upcoming Republican Primary.
 
The “communication issue” that led the commission to take a different direction on the FCDA is now being explained in more detail than initially provided by county officials.
 
County Manager Steve Rapson and Chairman Brown confirmed Monday that in August 2013, Rapson asked the authority to allow the commission to review all bond and property tax abatement documents prior to their being approved by FCDA.
 
Brown noted this would allow the county attorney to review the documents and make sure county taxpayers were getting a good deal in exchange for the tax breaks.
 
Several months following that request to FCDA — and without notifying the county manager or the commission — the authority in November approved a bond and tax abatement package for Pinewood Atlanta Studios, Rapson and Brown confirmed.
 
The documents were approved in open court in December by Fayette County Chief Superior Court Judge Christopher C. Edwards and advertised in the county legal organ.
 
“The development authority didn’t tell us they were doing any tax abatements,” Rapson said, noting that Brown and Fayetteville Mayor Greg Clifton gave a number of media interviews touting the Pinewood project and how it was unique because no property tax breaks were necessary to attract the studios here.
 
Rapson said the fault doesn’t lie with most of the outgoing FCDA board members, but he does feel the outgoing CEO Forshee and the resigned FCDA Chair, Randy Hayes, are responsible for not informing the county of the property tax abatement.
 
The ultimate cost to taxpayers on the Pinewood property tax break was calculated to be $144 million over the 20-year life of the bond, Rapson said, adding that he felt the county and the Fayetteville city governments would have been OK with the deal inked by FCDA had it been brought to them before the documents were finalized.
 
“The people who should have the biggest issue with this is the school system,” Rapson said, since the school system derives a major chunk of its revenue from property taxes.
 
Rapson said when he approached the FCDA in August asking for notice of any new tax abatement proposals, it was a “pretty long and detailed conversation” with FCDA representatives.
 
Rapson acknowledged that Georgia law does not require the county to have a look at the paperwork in advance, and said he further understood the FCDA has to be a separate entity from the rest of county government.
 
“I felt we had some key players we didn’t have a relationship with, who we were communicating with, that did not communicate with us,” Rapson said.
 
Rapson reiterated his feeling that Pinewood has always acted in good faith during the tax abatement negotiations and in its other dealings with the county.
 
Though Georgia law does not require the FCDA to give the county say-so over its bond and tax abatement power, the document review was necessary, Brown said, “so our county attorney could make sure they were in the best interest of the citizens of Fayette County.”
 
The county commission, at its April 10 meeting, voted to install five new authority members. Rapson noted that only one of the authority members who was replaced had applied for re-appointment, and that the other four seats had terms due to expire.
 
However, it was several weeks prior when it became public knowledge that FCDA CEO Matt Forshee was resigning to take an economic development job with Georgia Power in the Augusta area. FCDA Chairman Randy Hayes, in his resignation letter, would cite Forshee’s exit as a signal that it was a good time for him to resign as well.
 
Rapson said he chiefly blamed Hayes and Forshee for the lack of communication sought by the county back in August 2013.
 
Rapson said no officials think Pinewood pulled a fast one on the county by any means. However, the 20-year property tax break was significant since FCDA’s usual deal in years prior was a 10-year break instead.
 
Rapson also said the county commissioners would have questioned giving a property tax abatement for the former Rivers Elementary School site, since the idea of the school system selling the property was to get the building on the tax digest so it could be providing revenue to the county and the school system.
 
Meanwhile, at Thursday’s meeting of the Peachtree City Council, Councilwoman Kim Learnard criticized Brown, noting that FCDA meetings are open to the public and had he attended those meetings, he would have known about what FCDA was undertaking.
 
Learnard noted that both she and Mayor Vanessa Fleisch were aware of the property tax abatements granted to Pinewood Atlanta Studios, and Brown should have been aware of the bonds as well.
 
“Either our chairman knew about these bonds or he should have known about these bonds,” Learnard said. “I did. Mayor Fleisch did. But then again, we attended meetings and we own telephones.”
 
Brown chalked up Learnard’s criticism to politics, claiming that she is a supporter of one of Brown’s challengers in the May primary, former city Mayor Harold Logsdon.
 
“I’m sorry if she doesn’t like that, but I have a fiduciary responsibility to the citizens of Fayette County and we are not going to tolerate no communication, especially after we made a request to have that level of communication.”
 
Learnard at Thursday’s meeting said the 20-year break was deserved because of the scale of the Pinewood project and how it will be attracting other companies here to serve the movie industry in what Learnard said was comparable to what happened when Kia decided to build an automobile construction plant in Georgia.
 
Learnard cited “conservative projections” that show Pinewood contributing more than $300,000 in revenue for both the county governments and the Fayette County Board of Education by the fifth year of operations. Although Pinewood got a break on property taxes, which will start at 5 percent and increase by that amount each year ... the company will be bringing a significant chunk of sales tax money to the county also, which will not just benefit county governments sharing the 1 percent local option sales tax — but also the school system which benefits from the 1 percent educational special local option sales tax.
 
FCDA CEO Forshee has noted that sales from the Home Depot located on the Pinewood site, which will provide materials for set design among other things for each production, are expected to be significant, as such materials are generally around 30 percent of the cost of a given movie.
 
So for a $100 million movie here, Forshee indicated that the sales tax will provide around $300,000 in sales tax revenue for both the county and cities and another $300,000 for the school system.
 
Learnard took little effort, if any, to mince words in her criticism Thursday.
 
“At this point in time, due to what I can only call a one-man wrecking crew, every Fayette County Development Authority board member with the possible exception of the airport authority seat and the Tyrone seat is now gone,” Learnard said. “Mr. Brown has ushered about 50 years of institutional knowledge out the door. Decades-long relationships with recruiters at the Georgia Department of Economic Development, existing industry and six project teams at the Georgia Department of Economic Development, including corporate headquarters, high-tech, healthcare and more. Those are gone. Those long-standing relationships with the metro Atlanta chamber, real estate brokers, site selection professionals, power companies: gone.”
mrobinson_ptc
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Bogus $144 million "controversy"?

Still waiting for someone to prove where $144 million lost tax revenue figures came from...

I'll probably keep waiting, too...because it certainly seems to be untrue.

But it keeps the Fearless Leader's name in the papers, which is good at election time, for sure!

mrobinson_ptc
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Time for Math Again...

Since "Some folks twist the facts to suit their own agendas," I'd like to ask someone to fact check this.

I'm curious as to where the magic $144 million figure came from...I guess the valuation came back from the tax assessors. If you read the newspaper and own a calculator, however, I'm really not sure how in the world you can come up with the figure.

First, some references for your reading:

4/2013 - Even after expenditures by the county associated with the Pinewood Studio project, the county is projected to gain an additional $2.7 million in sales and property taxes over the first phase of the studio development, according to Forshee.

http://www.thecitizen.com/articles/04-04-2013/dozens-firms-seek-pinewood...

2/2013 - Pinewood Studios is perhaps best known for its role in the James Bond film series, and the company plans to initially build five state of the art sound stages and ancillary development for a total investment of $20 million. The hope is for construction to start this spring if permits are approved.

http://www.thecitizen.com/articles/02-13-2013/how-fayette-will-profit-bi...

3/2013 - In a spur-of-the-moment fall-back idea, Forshee suggested the studio execs take a look at a rural part of the county that might be more suited to a studio complex, Pace told the commission. One helicopter ride over the central Fayette expanse hooked the executives and led to the deal that is on track to bring Pinewood Studios here. - That's just to remind you that Steve Brown didn't come up with this idea.

http://www.thecitizen.com/articles/03-13-2013/pinewood-studios-project-g...

4/2014 - It is impossible to calculate the full value of the property tax break that the film companies are receiving, at this date, since the buildings and property have not yet had a final valuation established by the county tax assessor. Those calculations are expected to be finished in May.

http://www.thecitizen.com/articles/04-02-2014/pinewood-studios-will-pay-...

So, here's what I gleaned from that:
- Pinewood putting in a $20 million investment in building the facility;
- The parcel is about 220 acres
- No one understands the full value yet as of April.

So let's go off of the statistics here - 220 acres, $20 million investment. I went to our old friend, the Fayette County Tax Commissioner, to see what another very large industrial project in the County pays in taxes - NCR in Peachtree City.

http://www.fayettecountytaxcomm.com/PropertyTaxDetails2.aspx?TaxBillNumb...

On one of their sites, they have 14 acres, and in $2013, their TOTAL PROPERTY TAX paid (state, county, school) was $67,224, about 1.4% of their Fair Market Value (FMV). And for those of you who think that's way too low, divide what you paid in property taxes last year into your home's FMV, and see what percent you get. I got about 1.2% for mine.

OK, let's compare magnitude. 220 acres is about 16 times as much. NCR's Fair Market Value for their property was calculated at $4,855,580. So let's pretend that Pinewood's Fair Market value is 16 times as much - $77,689,280. If that's true, then they should pay...well...16 times what NCR paid, right? So that's....$1,075,584. In twenty years, assuming a progressively oppressive tax increase of 2 percent per year, total expected property taxes would total $26,133,862.20

(full disclosure after original posting, NCR has 29 acres all told according to Tax Commissioner records and paid $95849.44 in property taxes in 2013 on $6,923,136 in FMV, still 1.3% of the FMV)

Where in the world did $144 million come from? Can someone in a position of knowledge actually spell that out for me?

I think that someone didn't do the math right and is spending more time whining about not "knowing about something" it appears everybody else knew about while sitting on their high horses at Stonewall. When called on it, the blame is shift to politics and misdirection.

So, somebody show us the good math on this one, else I'll still believe this is an election time ploy by the incumbent to try to sway uninformed public opinion.

Show your work!

Husband and Fat...
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PTC Agenda Item

Mr. King was just added to the agenda for consideration on the FCDA. No offence to Mr. King, but Learnard needs to step up and ask to be considered. She thinks she's got it together with the vision people and she obviously thinks she had an in with the old regime, she needs to step up.

I'm sure Mr. King will do a good job, but does he really want it or is someone twisting his arm?

Steve Brown
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mrobinson

You do not like transparency in government, why?

This current Board of Commissioners has done the job well. What exactly do you have a problem with?

There is no whining. There is only a response to Kim Learnard's comments which were less than accurate. The Board of Commissioners, Fayette City Council and the Board of Education all were not given any advance notice prior to the passage of the abatements. Go ask them.

mrobinson_ptc
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Steve Brown (2)

Wow, apparently I got under someone's skin, didn't I?

To your point that the BOC, Fayetteville City Council and BOE didn't get any advanced notice, may I draw your attention to the following?

In terms of the city of Fayetteville’s knowledge of the bonds, FCDA board member and Fayetteville City Manager Joe Morton said Mayor Greg Clifton knew about the bonds several months prior to the issuance. Morton said it was on Nov. 7 that he notified the council and all city department heads that the bonds would be issued.

http://www.thecitizen.com/articles/04-09-2014/abc%E2%80%99s-bond-communi...

And, may I also draw your attention to this?

Forshee said notice is given for FCDA meetings, which are public meetings, though only a few citizens attend. Neither Fayette County staff nor commissioners usually attend the meetings, he said.

Forshee said bond attorneys handled the public notice required for the industrial revenue bond process.

“They manage it to make sure all the T’s are crossed and the I’s are dotted,” he said.

Meeting minutes from the May 30, 2013 FCDA meeting indicate that Project Stargate (the original name for the Pinewood Atlanta Studios project) was discussed, as it had been in a number of previous meetings.

When you were mayor in PTC, did the FCDA call you when they were inking tax deals with any of the industries they work with?

Do you get copies of the minutes? Do any of the board members of FCDA talk to you, like Joe Morton?

On to the other point - transparency...

Don't care and like are two different concepts. Liking transparency is fine - it's good to be able to get the information when you need it. When I want a tour of the sausage factory, I'll call the factory up. Most of the time, I just want to eat the sausage.

There is such as thing as too transparent. I should be able to have confidence that the people elected know how to do their jobs. Seeing in the paper that they don't through incompetence, name calling and grandstanding makes me lose confidence in the abilities of those elected.

Taking to the papers to resolve personnel issues is, again, too transparent. Did I need to learn that a Fayette County IS person was fired due to "political means", or that the Water System was led by someone who might not have the abilities, or that the other members of the Commission were ready to not vote in Steve Brown as chairman for his grandstanding acts....hey, wait a minute, maybe transparency isn't so bad after all!

In all seriousness, your approach of claiming transparency and then telling someone to "call the developer" to get the details seems a little duplicitous, wouldn't you say?

Husband and Fat...
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mrobinson PTC. Some clarifications

In your post 1 you referenced an article dated 3/31/13. In this article Forshee in his sell to the county identified revenue of $2.8m over 5 years coming from property and sales tax and $12.4m in the subsequent 9 years. Forshee sold everyone on this, then failed to correct this until owning up in April of this year that this revenue won't be received.

Then in this blog you state that "Do any of the board members of FCDA talk to you like Joe Morton?" For the record, Mr. Morton was on the FCDA, so your point is irrelevant.

Where's the integrity when someone or some group fails to correct a mistake? The FCDA sold the county on a project under false pretenses. Yes, we will see new revenue, and a bird in hand is worth 2 in the bush, but that shouldn't prevent anyone from doing business with integrity with the FC bible thumpers.

mrobinson, I seem to remember that you had a business relationship with Mr. Brown during his term as mayor. Can you remind us all about this situation? I just want to understand the dynamics here.

mrobinson_ptc
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Husband and Father - Needs Substantiation

1. Where did Forshee "own up" that this revenue won't be received? Sales tax revenue projections seem consistent, and Pinewood will be paying 5% of the property tax in 2014. That's about $55K (swag), or we could use a figure Kim Learnard quoted:

Matt Forshee, president of the FCDA, noted that Pinewood Studios would pay $89,500 in property taxes and sales taxes and $37,350 in school taxes beginning in 2014. - see one of my hundreds of other comments on this page for the link :).

Combining sales and property tax estimates from before (the $300K per movie figure), I still think the $2.8m is on track.

If Pinewood's only paying 5% of the property taxes this year, that means their "actual" property tax may be $2,537,000. After 20 years, the total property tax is still not even half of this magical $144 million figure being promoted as "lost", and each year they'll pay a bit more.

If they make 3 $100 million dollar movies there in a year, that's about $3 million in sales taxes that come to the County and BOE. Let's hope those studios churn 'em out!

2. My point wasn't irrelevant, it might have been confusing - I was referring to the fact Joe Morton and Greg Clifton/Fayetteville City Council communicated. Instead of grandstanding, the County simply could have kept in contact with a member of the board, but instead chose to sit on their collective arses and (to quote NUK_1) play "switch" instead of get to a public meeting. Peachtree City's Council found time, Fayetteville knew...when you run for elected office you should understand what is required - going to meetings, staying informed, etc. Don't assume someone will tell you things.

3. Ask NUK_1 indicated, I do have a shared experience with several elected officials in the county. I am, however, a private citizen, and am NOT running for office. My dynamics and agenda are simple - I wasn't scorned by any elected official. I believe, however, based on my experience and exposure, that there are agendas that are incompatible with how I believe local government should function.

We can certainly agree to disagree, and I will definitely be verbose, but I try to present facts and references to my arguments, versus others who blindly parrot talking points from the tea party express.

NUK_1
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H&F Here's the dynamics

he worked under both Brown and Haddix, which automatically qualifies you for sainthood in my opinion.

moelarrycurly
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H&F

He also worked during the Logsdon regime. That should tell you something. Something purposely left out.

Husband and Fat...
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Thank you

I'm in PTC, but got stuck in Ognios district. Therefore, I don't get to choose between the 3 former mayors running for commission.

All three have faults.

I'll start with Mr. Haddix. Some of his ideas have merit. Unfortunately, he has lots of trouble playing in the sandbox with others, takes everything personally, and has alienated too many people to be of positive service. I do think if he stays involved, tones it down like he has recently, he can certainly help make a difference. I have to give him appropriate approvals regarding his research.

Mr. Logsdon's term as mayor was somewhat bland. He has some positive financial supporters and appears to be in with some. To me, he lacks the enthusiasm to go the extra mile. I can't remember anything of substance that got accomplished during his tenure as mayor. He also has been out of sight for some time and doesn't say anything of substance on his website.

Mr. Brown has many loud critics within the city, mainly due to his tenure as mayor and the way he presented himself. I will give him credit for toning it down during his time as commission chair. I do think he has matured, though he still needs to ratchet himself in at times. Whether we agree with him or not, i do believe that he gives 100% of himself.

If push comes to shove, if the county wants to get younger, if we want to keep someone consistent in front of the state, if we want someone who tries their best to do what's in the best interest for the county, I think SB could be the way to go IF he can reign it in a little more.

I also look at it this way. If Logsdon wins, the other 3 and possibly 4 commissioners are always going to have doubts about him. In my opinion, none of the existing commissioners are strong enough to step in as chair. They don't have the personality to succeed as chair. The county will suffer as a whole.

Those are my thoughts at this time, take it however you want, because I can't vote for any of the three anyway.

ginga1414
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mrobinson, that's your opinion and

you know what they say about opinions.

I elected our public officials (commissioners) TO DO A JOB FOR ME!

I DO CARE ABOUT TRANSPARENCY, AND TOWN HALL MEETINGS WHERE INPUT FROM CITIZENS IS SOLICITED.

I DO CARE WHETHER OR NOT, my BOC and BOE have the information they need to plan their budgets for the coming year. In the case of the Pinewood tax break, that information will affect our Fayette budgets for the next 20 years. By the former FCDA director's own admission, that 20 year tax abatement information wasn't made available until recently. The information that had been made public concerned a 9 year tax break. There is a BIG difference in a 9 year tax break and a 20 year tax break.

County Administrator Steve Rapson, BOC Chairman Steve Brown and the BOE were doing their jobs when they requested Pinewood tax abatement information in Aug. 2013 from Matt Forshee and the FCDA. WHEN THAT INFORMATION BECAME AVAILABLE, MR. FORSHEE AND THE FCDA SHOULD HAVE PROVIDED IT TO THE BOC AND BOE.

All of this controversy started when Logsdon supporters realized they could twist the facts to their candidate's favor. Meanwhile, Mr. Logsdon says nothing about the subject. Mr. Logsdon hasn't addressed what I call the public, other than to publish extremely expensive political ads in the newspaper. He must have a whole lot of good old boy money backing him. I wonder why?

mrobinson_ptc
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All of this controversy started...

when Logsdon supporters realized they could twist the facts to their candidate's favor?

What facts are being twisted, do tell?

I'm soooo glad district voting is in this year!

mrobinson_ptc
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DO YOUR JOBS.

I'd like to boil all of this political bullhockey down to a simple primer for all elected officials to follow.

I ELECT YOU TO DO A JOB FOR US. THAT JOB IS TO MANAGE THE COUNTY. WE DON'T CARE ABOUT TRANSPARENCY, OR TOWN HALL MEETINGS WHERE YOU SOLICIT INPUT. WE EXPECT YOU TO EVALUATE PROPOSALS FOR THE BEST INTERESTS OF THE ENTIRE COUNTY, NOT THE VOCAL MINORITY. WHEN WE WANT SOMETHING, WE'LL CALL YOU.

When you don't get what you need, quit whining to the paper about it. Quit blogging to try to explain why you're whining. Quit trying to constantly justify your existence and blame politics.

Get the job done, folks. If you need us to define it after the election, you shouldn't be in office.

pips1414
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It's obvioous where this is going

Ms. Learnard is trying to discredit Commission Chairman Steve Brown by attacking him at Republican Primary Election time. Actually, Mr. Brown led the effort for the current balanced budget He was a great force behind the Pinewood project. Brown knew that the FCDA could be overly generous on the Pinewood tax abatement. When he and County administrator Steve Rapson sought to coordinate with the FCDA before it passed it's final plan, they were ignored. Bloggers ultimately blamed them for not attending FCDA meetings. However. few bloggers and even fewer FCDA members regularly attend commissioners meetings, or watch them on TV. Those who do have spoken positively to me about Brown's chairmanship, and the improved quality of the meetings. His effort for Pinewood is commendable, and was recognized as appears below:

Pinewood Project
• Steve Brown played a key role in securing the
Pinewood Studios project.
• Steve Brown led the effort to collaborate with
the Fayetteville City Council to get the first
phase built in just 10 months to meet Pinewood’s
schedule.
• The collaboration between the county and the
city was so extraordinary that the effort won the
Atlanta Regional Commission’s 2013 CREATE Award
for Regional Prosperity and Economic Development.
(http://www.atlantaregional.com/local-government/management--personnel/cr...)
• The Pinewood Studios effort also won the
Georgia Economic Developers Association (GEDA)
2013 Deal of the Year Award in the “Large
Community” category.
(http://www.thecitizen.com/articles/10-23-2013/gov-deal-pins-%E2%80%98dea...)

If Ms Learnard favors a different candidate, she should compare the accomplishments and qualifications of that candidate to those of Mr. Brown. Honest Abe was a good president, but he got slammed a lot more than Brown did. It would appear that whomever her choice may be has not generated significant positive accomplishments to even be in the same ballpark with Brown, or she would have already done that.

While the revenue generated from Pinewood looks good, those dollars are not yet a done deal.

Steve Brown
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mrobinson

You can ask the Pinewood people themselves. That is probably the best way.

Refocusing on their particular site. They were only going to be shown Peachtree City near the airport. Purchasing the Rivers Elementary School.
Working very closely with the developers on the project, even before there was a "Pinewood" involved.

Massively expediting the construction phase. Building a collaborative effort with the City Fayetteville, the likest of which had never been seen before. Pulling some things through higher government channels.

Hope that helps. Thanks.

mrobinson_ptc
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Steve Brown (1)

I shouldn't have to ask Pinewood - you're the one running for office. Show your cards and prove your worth. Remember, transparency should mean I can get all of your notes, voicemails and other actions.

Again, "Steve Brown" may or may not have done these things. I'm guessing, however, as it is with most things, it wasn't solely "Steve Brown."

Here's a better way to spin it, in my opinion:

"Under Steve Brown's leadership, Fayette County worked to land one of the world's largest movie studios, bringing thousands of jobs and millions of dollars to Fayette County."

Although, from reading the original story, it certainly seems like the idea came from somewhere else...

As for luring Pinewood Studios here, Fayette County Development Authority CEO Matt Forshee said much of the credit goes to the successful production of the Drop Dead Diva television show inside a former aircraft hangar at Falcon Field Airport (also known as Atlanta Regional Airport).

Forshee deserves a big attaboy for improvisation after Pinewood officials soured on the concept of locating at a “noisy” airport. Forshee took the Pinewood representatives up in the air for a helicopter ride over the serene, pastoral acreage along Sandy Creek Road, and the studio officials were hooked.

http://www.thecitizen.com/articles/03-31-2013/green-light-tv-movie-studi...

Oh, and the idea of developing around the area is before your time, too...

http://www.thecitizen.com/articles/07-10-2013/massive-new-%E2%80%98west-...

http://archive.thecitizen.com/node/9382.html

The implication that you did these things on your own, which is what a reasonable person can infer from statements made by Pips (and sometimes by you), is again the focus.

It's not what you say, it's how you say it.

borntorun
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Good Idea Steve

Give us a name and phone number and I'll be glad to call and ask about your participation. What? No name and number? Gee I'm shocked. Epic fail.

Spyglass
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So now you are pro development?

That is a big change on your part.

Tell us more...

I am not against Pinewood per say..the apparent flip flopping by you on the issues can be baffling for sure.

mrobinson_ptc
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What did Steve Brown do for Pinewood in his "key role"?

What did he do, exactly? Spell it out....key role usually means he got the players together, brokered the deal, etc.

What did he do, Pips?

NUK_1
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What Brown did for Pinewood

Well, for starters he lied constantly about how he would he stop the West Fayetteville By-Pass if elected, despite all the common-sense reality that ONE vote out of 5 is not going to stop a project if 2 others don't agree. That is blatant dishonesty. Sadly, the acolytes believed that line of BS. So he failed in stopping anything further from developing WFB which instead led to Pinewood being built! That's a big WIN for Brown in Brown's mind! Fail and lie to WIN! Maybe he needs that slogan for this upcoming race.

Sort of like his flip-flop 3 times on TDK, district voting, Westside Annexation, an illegal building moratorium, ethics charges confirmed against him in PTC and in FC.......yep, you get the government you deserve.

PTC Observer
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NUK_1 - Mr. Brown

"Victory has a thousand fathers, but defeat is an orphan."

John F. Kennedy

Spyglass
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So he was against the bypass and development

But for Pinewood? That is rich right there.

pips1414
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What Bypass, Spyglass?

Pinewood was built on Sandy Creek Road, which has changed in name only. The rest of the road ("Veteran's Parkway") is "the road to nowhere", and it never was a bypass. If you support the new phases North of there as worthy of what they cost, many readers would like to know why. Pinewood is supporting the rural characteristics of the area.

mrobinson_ptc
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Actually...the road gets you from 92 pretty quick.

From 92 to Lee's Mill - Lee's mill to the roundabout - then zip along to 54. I like it, and I can't wait until they finish the north side. For the south side, meh.

Randy Ognio
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I just want to add a few comments here.

The abatement was not the issue. No communication about the abatement to the BOC and BOE was the issue. When I found out about the abatement and that it was done mouths earlier, I told Chairman Brown and Administrator Rapson we had to do something so it does not happen again. One blogger called the commission incompetent. In my eyes, if we did not make some changes we should not expect better communication.
Peachtree City Councilwoman Kim Learnard calling Chairman Brown a one man wrecking crew is her opinion. She did not make any phone or email contact attempts with any BOC to ask any question pertaining to the issue. Learnard singling out Chairman Brown makes it obvious to me that she is trying to affect the election.
Four of the FCDA Committee Member terms were up for renewal and the Commissioners advertised for applications to fill those positions. From those applicants we chose four very qualified and diverse citizens to put into those positions. When Mr. Hayes turned in his resignation we chose one of the remaining applicants to fill that position. We had a lot of qualified citizens apply and it is hard to choose. There were tough decisions.
The FCDA did a great job getting Pinewood Studios here. The issue was the lack of transparency and communication. Fayette County Citizens deserve transparency where these abatements are publicized.
My hope is that all authorities and committees appointed by the board will see the need to have better communication between them and the BOC, and the BOE if so affected.

Robert W. Morgan
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Well now, he may not be that dumb, but Denise did not write this

Are you freaking kidding me? This is a commissioner and he's not even from the district 5 desert. Read this:

"Fayette County Citizens deserve transparency where these abatements are publicized."

I know he's not mine - I got Barlow who actually had the cojones to call me and ask for a vote for Studdard or some other damn fool. Well, it was a recording, so maybe no actual cojones.

So the, back to Ognio - get a grip on he language big guy.

ginga1414
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RWM, born, and PTC

Randy Ogino, isn't a typist, but he is a good, caring family man. He is a hard working, savy small business owner. And, when small businesses were folding left and right during the most current economic decline (depression?), Commissioner Ognio kept his family business afloat. He once told me that it killed him to have to let employees go during those hard times when families were losing their homes.

All of our current commissioners are good men. They truly care about our county and only want the best for our citizens.

Unless any of you have walked in their shoes, you would serve yourself, your family, and your community well to take the time to really know our commissioners.

I've lived in Fayette County for well over 40 years. I've lived through commissions that would walk through Travis Hardware (Fayetteville's Twisted Taco) and address each customer by their first name. Then, I've also lived through several "quiet governments."

Two or three of those "quiet governments" believed that Fayette citizens didn't have a right to know what was going on in our local government. They addressed taxpayers in a belittling manner. When citizens got too close to the truth, the "quiet" commissions either denied or plain out lied.

Sitting around and assuming we have all the answers concerning all of our elected officials does nothing to right the wrongs that exist among politicians. Opposing politicians who resort to the childish practice of calling other officials names or paste "insanity" labels on their efforts only reveal their true character. Ranting here just to hear our own heads roar doesn't accomplish a thing.

Our commissioners make a pittance for the efforts they extend on our behalf. Not long ago, I calculated that most of our commissioners carry home about 27 cents an hour. Who among us would even consider working for 27 cents an hour?

johenry
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Nothing has changed

Borntorun and the four other Brown hater bloggers can't fight on the facts. Throwing mud and shooting people in the back is all they have!!

It's the same four negative trash talkers over and over again. I liked things when their mouths were shut while Steve and commissioners were busy doing a great job.

mrobinson_ptc
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Negative Nancy...

I presented some statistics, which could even be interpreted as facts! Where are your facts? I'd prefer to fight on the facts...give me some!

Fact - noun - a thing that is indisputably the case.

Example - the parcels where Pinewood sits took in an average of $10,000 per year in property taxes before Pinewood developed the lots.

Misinformation - noun - false or inaccurate information, especially that which is deliberately intended to deceive.

Example - $144 million of tax revenue was lost due to the FCDA tax abatement deal.

What does the incumbent deal in....facts or misinformation?

ginga1414
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Woooo, born, that's a whole lot of negtivity

Where did you get all of that skewed information?

There is a Rotary forum tonight for all the candidates. The public is invited. It starts at 7:00 pm.

Just show up at the Wyndom Hotel Event Center, and have your questions ready.

borntorun
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Skewed? Negative? Really ginga1414?

Was Ognio arrested for a road rage incident and did he plead guilty? Yes. Did Barlow file for bankruptcy twice? Yes. Did Barlow defend Parrott and say “In God’s word we are told to ‘put on the whole armor of God that you may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.’” Yes. Did the PTC ethics board rule that Steve Brown had to repay the city for using a city secretary to drop off his daughter off at a golf camp? Yes. I had forgotten about it but did McCarty in 2003 fail to pay $3.398.75 in state and local option sales taxes and have tax liens filed against him? Yes.

So where did I skew anything? Do you know something I don't know?

As for being negative, well certainly being arrested, filing bankruptcy, violating city rules and failing to pay taxes are not positive things. So yes those things are negative. But only in the context of the actions. Not because someone accurately states what is on public record and previously reported in this paper. If I had stated something false then you would have a leg to stand on.

Sorry I missed the Rotary forum tonight. It appears Rotary and FCDA share something in common....not advertising its meetings.

moelarrycurly
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ginga & others on tonight

This is a meet and greet tonight only. Each candidate will be introduced and allowed 3 minutes to speak. Then, they will break to a table setting where you can go over and talk with them individually. This not in the auditorium in a town hall meeting format, where they will answer questions from the audience as a group.
One on one only.

hutch866
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Well ginga

Where is he skewed? Can you tell us now, or are you waiting for the memo from Steve?

borntorun
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ginga1414

Good men? Let's take a look at them.

As I said previously, the only thing I know about Randy Ognio is he was arrested and pled guilty to some road rage charge a few years back. I know nothing about his business acumen or his family life. If you say he's a keeper then fine.

David Barlow filed Chapter 7 Bankruptcy in 1986. Under Chapter 7 Bankruptcy, he asked a judge to relieve him of paying any amount of his debts.

Not being satisfied with not having to pay his bills in 1986, Barlow filed a second Chapter 7 bankruptcy in 1994. He once again asked a judge to relieve him of paying any amount of his debts.

Barlow also defended former Fayette Water Department Head Tony Parrott during the water crisis last year and accused those who wanted Parrott removed as being under the "influence and wiles of the devil". Sounds like a whack job to me and eventually Parrott was in deed removed of his duties.

Steve Brown.....where do you begin with his baggage? You could write a tome.

Allen McCarty and Charles Oddo....both appear to be doing a good job and sometimes are the only adults in the playroom it seems. Especially Oddo. I would like to see him as chair of the commission.

But whether or not they are "good men" or not and regardless of what they earn being a county commissioner (hey...nobody twisted their arm and made them run...well except for McCarty) if they were derelict in their duties and responsibilities with regard to FCDA and the Pinewood tax abatements, then it is fair game to call them out on it.

Being an elected official and accountable to the public, that's the price you pay for that 27 cents per hour you somehow calculated.

Husband and Fat...
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BTR, you forgot

McCarty and his 3 alleged tax liens.

But all this is normal isn't it. Tax liens, road rage, 2 bankruptcy's. It happens to the best of neighbors, doesn't it?

I think it's a prerequisite for any elected official to have financial and anger problems. Isn't there a school board member in metro Atl possibly going to jail because she lied and said the school supt tried to run her over with his car. It's epidemic.

ginga1414
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PTC, you are right about

the door to door approach to campaigning. It is a very personal, hands-on way of getting to know the voters.

During the last two commissioner campaigns, taxpayers all over the county hosted meet and greet opportunities in their homes. I attended several of those meetings and I also hosted one of the meetings.

In my very awkward way, I am trying to say that voters have a responsibility to educate themselves by making an effort, as well. I actually heard someone say that they voted for a candidate because he had a nice smile.

Door to door is great, but is it the most practical/efficient way to campaign?

Also, will a district commissioner only represent the folks in their particular district?

Because of past experiences with some of our former commissioners, I am a great believer in pro-active voting. A forum where all voters are able to ask questions of all candidates gives the voters a wider perspective. In other words, someone else might ask a question that I didn't think of asking. We don't live in little bubbles. We live in the world.

PTC, I hope you will forgive my rambling but it is late and bad weather looms.

PTC Observer
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Ginga1414 - Benefits of district voting

Thanks for your insight, and perhaps these kind of comments are even more valuable in a district voting system. After all you know your neighbor don't you? It's kind of refreshing to see candidates going door to making contact with the people they will represent.

Much better than waving with signs on the roadside. Mr. Brown could learn from his opponents on this point

Thanks again for the insight on Randy Ogino, I am sure he is a nice man in person.

PTCO

Husband and Fat...
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Man crush

Barlows got a big man crush with Studdard.

Need to do a little more homework, but I like Gil Williams.

borntorun
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Randy's 'Riting

Unfortunately he's mine. His broken syntax, while not as bad as Donnie's, is pretty bad. ginga1414 says Ognio is a business genius. I guess English is not necessary in the construction world.

PTC Observer
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Yikes!

Could it be that district voting will actually get people to focus on the qualifications of the person that represents their interests?

borntorun
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Why Yes, PTCO!

I do believe you are correct. I'm just sorry I don't get to participate in running off The Brown Clown and Donnie.

Davids mom
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Responsibility

Voters can't blame the 'other guy' for electing the leader of their District. Vote!!

PTC Observer
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Mr. Ognio - My comments

My comments on the BOC's incompetence to stay informed was not meant to offend but to describe the inaction of the Commission. You and the other commissioners are well aware of the independence of the FCDA and what obligations they have or don't have to keep you informed. A "command" from the commission to stay informed is legally pretentious at best but at face value incompetent. Changing the members of the FCDA does nothing to solve the communication requirement by that authority.

No Mr. Ognio, it is the obligation of the BOC and its staff to maintain vigilance of this authority to insure its input into the process is heard. Let's face the facts here, the BOC dropped the ball. There's nothing that has changed except faces at the FCDA, the legal requirement to communicate has not changed. It is up to our elected officers to stay on top of this. You and the other Commissioners were AWOL on this one.

As I indicated in my previous post, this may not have been a bad thing, there's no telling how bogged down the decision making process could have gotten with politics involved. No one knows what the outcome may have been with the BOC, but my guess is that the FCDA knew. However, the BOC can't simply throw up its collective hands and say "we didn't know anything about it" and expect a sympathetic audience.

At least not from this poster.

Spyglass
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Sadly, I can only vote for ONE Commissioner...so why

Should care what they other 4 think?

For those confused, look up sarcasm. :)

Thanks NAACP for looking out for ME.

ginga1414
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Mr. Ognio

I would like to thank you very much for taking the time to explain in detail the circumstances surrounding the Pinewood tax abatement and the actual reasons we have a new FCDA. Thank you so much for your service to our community!!

ginga1414
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borntorun

I'm not a business person, but it is very obvious to me that communication between department heads is vital for a successful business. It is also quite obvious to me that Mr. Ognio is a very astute business man. Otherwise, how could he have been the president of a very successful business for so many years?

born, Mr. Ognio and Mr. Brown have no obligation to you or anyone else to explain the circumstances surrounding the communication problems with the FCDA. However, both of those commissioners promised the citizens that we could expect an open, transparent Fayette government from them. They are delivering on that promise.

I feel sure that if anyone here would have the professional attitude of asking our commissioners questions in a respectful manner, they would receive professional, respectful answers.

Ms. Learnard has her own agenda. I have seen and heard her soliciting support from the commissioners for several of her pet projects. I have never seen or heard any of our commissioners be anything but professional and respectful of her when they were approached.

ginga1414
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born, just as I suspected

You know nothing about Mr. Ognio and his qualifications. Yet, you assume and proceed to lambast him.

Not cool, born!!

borntorun
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Never Was Cool ginga1414

You are right. I don't know anything about his qualifications as far as his business goes. All I know of Mr. Ognio is his arrest and subsequent guilty plea to some kind of road rage incident a few years back that was in the papers. Do you know everything about every elected official? Didnt think so. Nor should you be expected to. I'm not lambasting him. I'm saying that the Fayette Co BOC was asleep at the wheel regarding the abatement issue. Again....how did the other elected officials know and they didnt. Because they failed in their duties as county commissioners to know.

Husband and Fat...
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Question BTR

The FCDA is independent yes. But they are paid by the BOC and PTC.

I will agree 100% that commission should have gone to meetings. I for one never knew they had monthly meetings open to the public because I thought this info was similar to executive sessions (private). I also never saw the meetings listed on their website or posted in the paper.

If you pay my salary out of your pocket, don't you want to know what I am doing?

Husband and Fat...
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BTR and abatement

We will never know the real story. After reading the articles a number of times, my intuition tells me that the FCDA did not inform the BOC or BOE out of spite and "southern politeness" lol is getting in the way of someone calling the other a liar.

If abatements are normal business practices, than why was it not publicized like Cobb county and the Braves?

Someone didn't want to man up and deal with the complaints while searching for the next personal conquest.

Just my intuition.

borntorun
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And You May Be Right H&F2

I said way back in the beginning of this discussion that there are two sides to every story and the truth is usually somewhere in the middle. Heck, I might even buy into your "southern politeness" theory except one thing Brown has never been known for is "southern politeness". The man will never walk away from an opportunity to run roughshod over someone who disagrees with him. And if FCDA out and out refused to provide the abatement information, no way Brown lets Matt get away with that. My guess is Rapson and Brown asked for it and then forgot about it. As did FCDA. And when the you know what hit the fan, then Rapson and Brown started pointing fingers at FCDA rather than admit they dropped the ball by not following up on the initial request. Funny how other elected officials knew about it and these two didn't. Incompetence....thy name is Steve. Rapson....Brown.....take your pick.

borntorun
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Really Steve....I mean ginga1414?

You're saying an elected official has no responsibility to respond to his or her constituents questions? Who do you think they work for? I have no knowledge of Mr. Ognio's business and whether or not it is a successful one but I fail to see what that would have anything to do with this situation. Perhaps if anything he was too busy with his business to properly attend to the duties of being a county commissioner. If that's the case maybe he should reconsider being one.

moelarrycurly
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Really btr....I mean Harry Logsdon?

You have no idea about Mr. Ognio because you have never bothered to meet with him or communicate with him. I have. You are out of line in so many ways.

I support cleaning out the long-time have lunch meeting and go home former members. This county will be better served with new members and fresh ideas. Even the FCDA rep. from the airport board agrees with this change. Their terms were up. The BOC is charged with forming a board that they feel will do what is good for the future development of this county. If I were a BOC member and found information was not being shared with me or other BOC members, I would find replacements, too. So would you or anyone else.

borntorun
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That's Wonderful MLC

If you believe the FCDA board should have been replaced that's your prerogative. I have a different view. That's my prerogative. As for the not sharing, no one seems to be willing to say that FCDA out and out refused to share the abatement information. Which imho means there is shared culpability. But your "have lunch meeting and go home" comment is comical. You really think that with all the business including Pinewood brought into Fayette County by the old FCDA was due to "have lunch meeting and go home"? You funny!

moelarrycurly
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You funny, too!

Rapson already said he asked for the information in August. Was it given to him? No. I call that refusing to share. Reminder below:

http://www.thecitizen.com/articles/04-23-2014/fayette-officials-%E2%80%9...

Last I checked it was staff and Matt Forshee who worked the business retention and recruitment, not Authority board members.

Pinewood was a Group VI(Jim Pace)and eventually Dan Cathy creation, working with Mr. Dunleavy. Are you saying Hayes, Harris, Smelley, Woody and Morton brought Pinewood here? Not even close.

Everyone, refresh your memories on this below...I see not one word of FCDA, other than Matt Forshee's efforts.

http://www.thecitizen.com/articles/01-21-2014/pinewood-atlanta-studios-o...

Yes, we do have differing views. A new Authority board will form and bring a fresh outlook to a new development phase for this county. Matt Forshee chose to go into the private sector, a corporate job where he will thrive. He has made his mark here and he is right, there is not a lot left for him to top the Pinewood deal.

borntorun
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Funny Is Good

We agree that Rapson asked for the information. I have never said anything to the contrary.

But the question is.....when asked, did FCDA say no and refuse to provide it or was it something that fell through the cracks? No one seems to be able or willing to say. But its a huge difference between the two.

And when not provided the information why did not Rapson or The Brown Clown ask for it again?

Yes...Matt would have been the lead person from FCDA to be involved with the recruitment of Pinewood. But if you don't think the FCDA Board had some involvement with that you are sadly mistaken about what the Board members are charge with doing as a Board member. Matt as President and CEO of the FCDA reports to and takes his marching orders from the Board.

I don't feel sorry for Matt except for the way this has been played out in the papers. He would never be able to top Pinewood and yes he will make more money in his new job. I wish him well.

As for the new Board, well time will tell how effective they are but a development authority is by law a separate legal entity. From the way this has been handled it is apparent that The Brown Clown thinks its his Board.

borntorun
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Mr. Ognio

Your lack of understanding of economic development and the business recruitment process is rather shocking. You do realize don't you that the FCDA is an independent entity and legally has no obligation to discuss any sensitive issues regarding recruitment with you, me or anyone else. There is a reason development authorities were created in that manner. I suggest you do some research in the matter.

But I have a few questions for you. Was the lack of communication between FCDA and Fay Co BOC intentional or not? Did you ask FCDA for the information and they said no or was it a failure on your part to follow up with the request? Why didn't you or someone else from the Fay Co BOC make it a point to attend the FCDA meetings where the abatements were made public? How did other elected officials know and the Fay Co BOC not know? Isn't there some culpability on your part?

Randy Ognio
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Answers to questions

I do understand that they are an independent entity with the authority to do abatements and they don’t have to have any input from the BOC. After the abatement is done they have to communicate the tax assessor’s office so that the tax is billed correctly but should report it to the BOC and BOE because it affects the budgets. If they don’t communicate the tax bill will go out at 100% of value instead of the abated value. For the record I never said the FCDA had any obligation to discuss any sensitive issues regarding recruitment nor did I ask for any.
“Was the lack of communication between FCDA and Fay Co BOC intentional or not?” I do not know but I hope not.
“Did you ask FCDA for the information and they said no or was it a failure on your part to follow up with the request?” I personally did not ask the FCDA but I knew that Administrator Rapson and Chairman Brown had both asked. So should every commissioner have to ask?
“Why didn't you or someone else from the Fay Co BOC make it a point to attend the FCDA meetings where the abatements were made public?” While it would be nice to attend every committee meeting but, it is not practical and they did not advertise the fact what meeting they were doing the abatement.
“How did other elected officials know and the Fay Co BOC not know?” I cannot answer this because I don’t know.
“Isn't there some culpability on your part?” Yes, that why changes were made to promote more communication.

MYTMITE
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Mr. Ognio, I am offering you some unsolicited advice-----

Do not continue to blog on this site. You will only cause yourself a lot of unnecessary grief. No matter what you say, it will not be taken kindly by some, misconstrued by others and others will try to find a way to make you look like a fool. If you must, write a letter to the editor, state what you want to say and leave it at that. You only have to look back over the years on this site to see what I mean. The back and forth between bloggers and a city, county, or state official never bodes well for the official. If people are that interested in an issue let them go to the council or other meetings and bring up their questions at that time.

As I said at the beginning, this is unsolicited and I am sure you will do what ever you feel is right. I don't know you personally, know nothing about you----but I do know what has happened with others in the past.

Spyglass
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You can try and tell them that..

But a certain percentage just will not listen.

It is excellent advice for sure..

borntorun
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Responses To Your Answers

Your answers show a lack of initiative and laziness on your and your fellow BOC members part.

“Was the lack of communication between FCDA and Fay Co BOC intentional or not?

Answer: I do not know but I hope not."

Based on the actions of BOC it would seem that you think so. Or else why totally tear down the prior FCDA Board. Matt and the FCDA have done good things for Fayette County. Never mind...I can answer that one...that is Steve Brown's modus operandi. Micro management and wanting to take credit for something.

“Did you ask FCDA for the information and they said no or was it a failure on your part to follow up with the request?"

Answer: I personally did not ask the FCDA but I knew that Administrator Rapson and Chairman Brown had both asked. So should every commissioner have to ask?"

Perhaps not but if Rapson and Brown were not getting the information should they have not followed up with FCDA? Did they? And if it was such a priority then why did the others not get involved?

“Why didn't you or someone else from the Fay Co BOC make it a point to attend the FCDA meetings where the abatements were made public?

Answer: While it would be nice to attend every committee meeting but, it is not practical and they did not advertise the fact what meeting they were doing the abatement."

There are five members on the Fayette Co BOC. Rotating attendance at the FCDA meetings between all commissioners would mean each member would only attend the FCDA meetings 2-3 times per year. I would consider it part of your job description as a county commissioner.

“How did other elected officials know and the Fay Co BOC not know?”

Answer: I cannot answer this because I don’t know.

I can answer this one too. Because the others made it a priority to attend and stay in the loop. You have no one to blame for not knowing but yourselves.

“Isn't there some culpability on your part?”

Answer: Yes, that why changes were made to promote more communication.

Interesting answer there. You seem to be putting all the blame on FCDA when in fact there was just as much blame on the Fay Co BOC. Perhaps the voters will also see that the other side of this problem will be taken care of in the upcoming elections. If so, you will only have yourself to blame.

mrobinson_ptc
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Careful, watch for spin below...

The "Brownies" and the "Brown Bashers" are out in full force in these comments...

Steve Brown
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We will keep the good things moving forward

By now, I have been asked many, many times why Kim Learnard is launching a verbal war against the Board of Commissioners. The perspective from my end has been to cite her right to speak out and hope that she does not escalate the situation any further and erode the relationship between the county government and Peachtree City.

We have a lot of good things on the way and some exciting announcements to make in the future on projects and we will keep pushing forward,hoping the animosity will go away.

Steve Brown
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PTC Observer

There are a lot of things. Leading the opposition to the regional T-SPLOST kept us from getting dragged into a regional mass transit system and saved us a lot of future expense.

Pinewood Studios and collaboration with Fayetteville to get the job done was won some awards and recognition.

Ending deficit spending after years of going backwards on poor policy.

Ceasing the dysfunction of the water utility after decades of neglect and bringing it back to a good state of repair and operation.

Creating the most open and transparent government in Fayette's modern history.

Those are in no particular order. There are some good comparisons to be made.

PTC Observer
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Mr. Brown

Thank you for your reply

PTC Observer
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Mr. Brown - Give

Give us your perspective on what you believe are the five most important things you have done to improve the county during your tenure. Please explain the outcome of each and how you personally were instrumental in getting these accomplishments executed.

Thanks in advance for your clear concise answer.

ginga1414
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PTC Observer, I would like to elaborate

on the issue of the Hwy.74/I-85 Interchange and Mr. Brown's efforts. Mr. Brown started the effort to make improvements at the interchange when he was mayor of Peachtree City.

It is my understanding that when Harold Logsdon was voted in as mayor of Peachtree City, the efforts to improve the interchange died.

As a county commissioner, Steve Brown got the effort to improve the interchange going again and significant progress has been made.

I have been told that the engineering and the right-of-way land funding has been obtained.

It is a well known fact that I have not been a fan of the Atlanta Regional Commission (ARC), but as Fayette County's representative on the ARC, Mr. Brown has recently gotten a significant fund increase in the ARC's transportation plan for the interchange project. That funding is for a more expensive design that will move traffic more efficiently.

A great deal of that traffic originates in Peachtree City. Correcting the problems at the Hwy. 74/I-85 interchange will greatly improve the drive time and the lives of all those Peachtree City commuters.

It is a sad state when Ms. Learnard and some others here from Peachtree City feel compelled to discredit and belittle Steve Brown's efforts to improve their lives.

It seems as though some people in Peachtree City are never satisfied with the folks they put in office.

pips1414
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Steve Brown

Looks like the same folks out to blast Brown again. Funny thing, you don't see these people at the commission meetings. If they would take some time away from blasting Brown and go to the meetings they would immediately see how much better and more open the commission meetings are from years past. If you'll remember, you the people, voted out the last five commissioners obviously because you felt they were not acting in the best interest of Fayette County. It was you who put Brown in. Look at all your PTC mayors... you voted them out, too, but you have little to say about why.

Brown on the other hand, has interacted with the people, and gotten the attendance of the meetings increased. What really surprises me is that the "Brown Blasters" don't have anything good to say about the other candidates. To me, these same people who do nothing but attack Brown are hoping to get his opponents elected on a smear campaign.

Brown has done more than the other 2 candidates combined to further the I-85 Hwy 74 interchange.Read all about it at http://www.thecitizen.com/articles/09-20-2013/partial-cloverleaf-now-fav....

Steve Brown
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mrobinson
mrobinson_ptc
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What an assault!

It's never good to have a differing opinion about how to spend money - what an all-out assault!

That's quite a "war" going on.

mrobinson_ptc
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a textbook example of spin...well done!

Funny, nothing I read indicates that the comments Ms. Learnard made were targeted at the entire commission. It seems she focused on a "one-man wrecking crew". It looks like you're using the Board of Commissioners term in a manner similar to the royal "we", interchangeable with another favorite pronoun you enjoy using! (I...I...I)

If we polled the other members of the commission, would they agree that the entire commission is being assaulted?

You, sir, are not the Board of Commissioners. You are one of five. You get to sit in the middle seat because the other four didn't want to. You get to lead the meetings, and.....well, that's it, really. Sure, you get to be on other committees and go to ARC, but if three of your cohorts decide next year to have someone else do it, then someone else will do it..that is, if you're even around to see it if you survive the primary.

I can only wonder if the tea party express is, perhaps, manufacturing some conflict here...again. I can't wait for the "exciting" announcements upcoming, since this veiled threat was certainly "exciting"!

It's not what you say, it's how you say it.

Husband and Fat...
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Interesting

Do the sitting commissioners throw their support to Mr. Brown who helped all get elected?

Do they support someone else knowing one of them will have to step up to chairman?

Does anyone REALLY think one of the 4 would be the person you choose to run your multi million dollar business?

mrobinson_ptc
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Oddo.

'nuff said.

Husband and Fat...
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Does he have

Testicular fortitude? I haven't seen it.

mrobinson_ptc
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Well, I'm guessing he's not a WWE superstar...

...but do we need that or do we need professionalism? You can be strong without being a jerk about it.

Again...my point is and will continue to be:

It's not what you say, it's how you say it.

Husband and Fat...
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Okie dokie

Guess we have to disagree. It's like comparing leadership classes at Bob Jones Univ. Vs Army War College. Different approaches.

NUK_1
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Different approaches?

Besides the brainwashed acolytes who would vote for Brown even if he committed heinous crimes, is there anyone who thinks that Brown exudes anything resembling "leadership?" I never saw a hint of it in PTC and sure haven't seen it now.

Brown is great at using the "bullshi...err bully pulpit" to run his mouth and lie constantly while flip-flopping on every issue he's ever been involved in, and I have a real hard time trying to understand that he's a leader of anything besides himself. The man has no real-world experience in anything besides being a blowhard politician that got destroyed as Mayor of PTC and then his laughable run versus Matt Ramsey. He picked low-hanging fruit when he ran against Jack Smith and congrats, Steve, you managed to resurrect your horribly failed political career! Now, the rubber is about to hit the road. Maybe you can manage to get more votes than the laughable Haddix did, which was remarkably even less than your pathetic race against Logsdon before.

I got an idea.....why don't Brown, Haddix and Logsdon just simply have a steel-cage death match? 3 go in.....only one comes out!That would do us all a big favor.

Robert W. Morgan
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Career? That's insulting to people who have careers.

After May his W/L record will be 2 wins, 3 losses.
He won against an anonymous Delta pilot by running against Bob Lenox who wasn't running and #2 victory was against the ultimate in croneyism (although I mean that in a good way) Jack Smith.

Losing to Ramsey, of course and then twice to Logsdon.

He can only win when he has an incumbent opponent that has some serious dissatisfaction and an electorate that has heard of him, but doesn't know him - meaning the anti-Lenox or anti-Smith people vote for anyone but the incumbent. Next month, he's the incumbent and thanks to district voting the electorate mostly live in his subdivision (I'd be embarrassed, Planterra) or nearby.

If somehow we keep him and Haddix to under 200 votes apiece, maybe they will go away - or at the very least their
main source of funding (the household budget) will be put off-limits.

Note to Todd Strickland, please donate some money to Logsdon or at least put a sign in your yard to put to rest these horrible rumors that you are one of the Brownies that NUK_1 describes above.

borntorun
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Good Reason Todd Won't Dead DJ

Because he is a Brown Clown lap dog. Sit back, grab an adult beverage of your choice and watch him.

Robert W. Morgan
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That is very sad if you are right

I really hope you are wrong or maybe he will come to his senses on May 20. Todd is an intelligent guy with a strong professional career and he should have nothing to do with a political and real life clown like Brown.

I will certainly watch - probably with George Dickel (insert your own joke here) and branch water. Go figure.

mrobinson_ptc
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You know Bost would be hiding under the ring...

...deleted...

Husband and Fat...
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Haddix

Would have the lovely valet Pumpkin. (With some brass knuckles). And the insurance company rep as the secret referee.

borntorun
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Two Sides to Every Story

There are two sides to every story and I have found the truth is usually somewhere in the middle. What's interesting about this article is it fails to offer Matt's side of the story. Now maybe Cal reached out to Matt and Matt declined to comment. If that's the case you will usually see that printed in the article. But given Cal's very public bromance with The Brown Clown (remember when he gave him free space to write a weekly column when he was running for office?) and Cal's anti-growth stance, I have to wonder if that's the case. So maybe....just maybe....Cal was using his paper as a bully pulpit to make a point. Which by the way he has every right to do. It's his paper. But one thing the Fayette Citizen has never been accused of is journalistic integrity and this may be a good example of that.

Editor
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Perhaps you overlooked the April 9 story
borntorun
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Yes Cal, I Did Read That

But it doesn't address the accusation that FCDA refused to provide The Brown Clown and Rapson with the information they allegedly asked for. There is a vague reference to "if we failed to provide then its my fault" in your previous story. However, there's a difference between accidently failing to provide and intentionally not providing the information as the Brown Clown is accusing FCDA of doing. A quick follow up phone call with Matt to get his response to that would provide that answer. But it really doesn't matter at this point I guess. Water under the bridge and all.

Husband and Fat...
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Politics suck

And what's worse is that a department that should be apolitical such as the FCDA gets sucked into the petty and childish games to enrich themselves. Ms. Learnards rant is purely political. Discussing a bond doesn't mean approving a bond.

Not one of our elected appear to be true public servants. They are all in it for themselves and I think I will really look hard before I vote for a Fayette County encumbant.

And what is really hypocritical is how most candidates state what church they attend, pray before each meeting, then stab each other in the back and vote for whatever serves them best at the time.

True public servants do what is best for the community regardless. They tell the truth and work with each other for the betterment of the community. Would we have sold the school to Pinewood had we known about the bond? No. We would have sold it to one of the many schools now looking to locate here.

I know I sound like DM today, but the secrets and pettiness is like walking into the lady's locker room at the clubhouse.

Davids mom
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Oh heaven forbid!!!!!
Quote:

I know I sound like DM today, but the secrets and pettiness is like walking into the lady's locker room at the clubhouse.

LOL! What is a husband and father doing in the lady's room at a clubhouse?

moelarrycurly
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Politics suck up close and personal

You can get a pantload of it Monday night at PTC City Hall for the first BOC Forum.

Chairman Brown, Don Haddix, Harry Logsdon (Post 3) and Allen McCarty (post 5)

Meet and Greet at 6:30PM and Forum from 7 to 8:30PM

Hosted by the FC Republican Party

Husband and Fat...
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No Pota?

Probably not a good idea to miss this on her part if she wants to be taken seriously.

moelarrycurly
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Is Pota

A demo or a repub?